With 2008 at an end, it is time again for our readers to select the screwiest of the screwballs, and if you want to take part in this, hop on over to my section of TheologyWeb here and cast votes in each of the many Platinum Award threads. Polls close Jan. 30 and results will be posted in next month's feature. You can check out the Screwies that didn't make this list here.
Last month's feature brought Alexander Hislop back to life and had him reviewing my toon site:
Clearly it is of a female rabbit holding a large penis and twisting it. As a man, I can imagine that this would hurt. The penis in your cartoon has also gone blue with pain. Now putting cartoon bondage on your website is a disgrace.
May I ask you to take it off immediately before children see it. The picture? This one:
I was horrified to see cartoon pornography on your website. I am referring to this picture here
Clearly it is of a female rabbit holding a large penis and twisting it. As a man, I can imagine that this would hurt. The penis in your cartoon has also gone blue with pain. Now putting cartoon bondage on your website is a disgrace.
May I ask you to take it off immediately before children see it.
The picture? This one:
What a goofball. Anyone can see that Annabelle is not a rabbit.
The Fluffy Rant Center sent this email:
I found your site after messing around with 911 conspiracy videos on UTube, which led me to some chap called Alan Watt or something. Who in my opinion was a rude and narrow minded person. But his site did link me to you, I think. Anyway I got there eventually and read some of your stuff about the inquistion and pagan fish symbols and so on. But what I don't undertand is why christians are so defensive. If I had the backing of an omnipotent being I wouldn't care what anybody thought or said about me or my religion.
I am not a christian or even a believer, neither am I a sceptic as you call them. Just because I don't believe something doesn't mean that it isn't true. On the same hand though, just because I do believe something that also does not automatically mean that I cannot be wrong. I found on your site the same dogged narrowmindedness that my younger brother possesses. He being a full on dyed in the wool christian who has worked for the church in some of the worlds roughest places. Places where I, being an ex soldier wouldn't have gone without the back up of the entire British Army. Now I take my hat off to this sort of conviction in any person but I still find it staggering that out of all of the christians that I have met (and I've met a lot through him) none of them have the objectivity to simply say "Yes I do believe but I also must admit that my belief may be wrong". Now I have never met a thick as two short planks christian. Most of them are intelligent well meaning people who seem simply to want to live in a better world. Yet regardless of their intelligence not one of them has the objectivity to admit that my point about being narrowminded is valid. Its not as if I would jump on them and call them blasphemers if they did. I would merely think better of them and their beliefs. For instance I believe we are not the only planet in this universe with life on it. Can I prove it? of course not. I could probably come up with a few well rationed arguments to support my beliefs and even if they were shot to pieces it would still not stop me believing what I believe. This however is a faculty that seems devoid in all christians that I have met. It would be nice to hear just one say " Yes we could be wrong but we don't think so" But they never do. Hence I stick with my view of christians as nice but narrowminded people. I would be interested in hearing your view on this subject.
I love these kinds of emails, which was sent about my article on the secular references to Jesus:
Your article was lovely and certainly well-written, but you quite conveniently avoided all mention of the dozen or so historically documented myths of savior gods whose stories match that of Jesus to a tee, and ALL OF THEM predate the Jesus myth by hundreds of years. You know them all too well, so I’ll spare you the insult of listing them by name here.
Jesus never existed; not the man, not the god.
Here's another good one, from Stupid People Feeling Put Upon:
Your argument that the Bible is too complicated to be understood by ordinary people who do not have specialized knowledge, but simple enough for people to understand how to be “saved” is merely an argument for authority. Since only someone like you (or possibly only you) are smart enough and informed enough to make judgments about the material, then the ordinary person must take your word for it that they need to be “saved”. This is the rationale of priesthoods from the beginning of the human race, a scam perpetrated for the maintenance of power over the masses.
You may be the world’s leading expert on angels and the most knowledgeable scholar on the geometry of pinheads, but you cannot reduce my contempt for the practice by placing more angels on the head of a pin than anybody else.
Mr. Sum It Up and Spit writes me:
In your review of his book Deceptions and Myths of the Bible, which I have read, and found difficult to follow much of the time, you state there is no proof for any of the things he describes. This is not unlike the Bible, which also offers absolutely no proof for all the childish, ridiculous, inane, mythical [profanity] contained therein.
This, from the Please Make It Easy on Us Dumb People Department:
I wish my first visit to your page gave me a better sense on it trying to make things more clear. You should try and be less cryptic with your rebuttings.
I found what is below in an article from: Journal of Early Christian Studies
It's just a couple of pages. It makes clear with little effort. While your "piercing" desire to get one to believe something prophetic is, I have to say, pathetic. If you wish I could send the whole article.
As an aside, I have three items re Ps 22 indexed, and two of them are off site, and one is on my site but by a guest. I have a suspicion that stupid here was reading Glenn Miller's article.
Next, email from the La La League, under a subject heading referring to my article on Harpur's Pagan Christ:
I can not believe you would say such thigns about someone else's opinion, saying that there is no hard evidence, or that the people that he lists as sources are "fringe". How could one make such claims, while defending his own religion which also has no hard evidence of it's claims as well, besides many people believing in it. Maybe you should not be so worried as to whether or not his ideas ar right or wrong and persuade other people to believe in your ideas. Instead maybe you should try to send the message that every person is entitled to their opinion, and that regardless of whether there is one Gnostic God, there are no Gods, or there are more than one maybe you should remember that it does not affect you. I believe that in a large religion, Christianity, it is said that if you follow the 10 Commandments, you will be rewarded with eternal life in heaven; however if you disobey them you will be tortured and burned forever in Hell...
It seems to me that regardless of what you do, it will still be allowed to happen and you will only 'speak for your actions' when you die. But if that is so, we all die alone, no one else takes the 'journey' with us, so why should it ever matter whose religion is what, except to not feel alone in the world, and have a false sense of purpose in life. Maybe you should just spend time spreading the great message to Love everyone other than spreading hate about other people.
Here's one from the Mr. Rogers School of Logic:
I just read your page titled 'sleepy' (in the URL). I know it must be difficult reading the Bible with the preconceived notions of nominal Christianity; you see things that just aren't there. After all, the Bible clearly teaches that the seventh day is the Sabbath, but most of Christianity keeps the first day of the week. But I digress. I'd like to give you an argument you did not cover in your page. Consciousness after death considerably waters down the sacrifice of the Son of God. In the garden, He was sweating drops of blood, clearly dreading what was before Him. The only logical conclusion that can be drawn from that is that He was not facing life after death. Many martyrs faced suffering and death with gladness, knowing they would have a good resurrection, or even believing they would be taken up to heaven immediately after. But not Jesus. He knew that the wages of sin is death, goodbye to life not for three days, but forever. He felt the guilt of my selfishness as if it were His own, and He could not see through the portals of the tomb. He experienced the death that was promised to Adam. The only reason that Adam did not experience it is because Jesus stepped in and took his place. He demonstrated this by literally covering Adam and Eve, with cloths of skin, from the first animal on earth to die (I believe it was from a lamb). Four thousand years later, the sentence was executed. Many martyrs have suffered more, and longer, physically, than did Jesus. But no one thus far has suffered the second death, goodbye to life forever, as Jesus has.
This email from the I See Where This is Going Commission:
I am the man you call the Savior and I have been proving that for 53 years which created the fulfillment of about 300 prophecies. Are you interested in looking in my wake?
Finally, a reader received this message -- sample:
JESUS CHRIST/YHVH IS HERE ON EARTH! He has the cure for AIDS, and Cancer! JESUS CHRIST/YHVH IS HERE ON EARTH! He has the cure for AIDS, and Cancer!
Google: 4647773 (Learn how AIDS was created by the Satanists, as an act of Genocide)
EMAIL ME @ email@example.com, AND I WILL TELL YOU MORE,JESUS IS HERE, YOU CAN FIND HIM @ MichelleNye You Tube subscriber site, his name @ this reincarnation is Brian Leonard Golightly Marshall, Jesus Christ, God in the flesh. ARCHIVED INFORMATION by Brian Leonard Golightly Marshall is located at the following site www.holyconspiracy.com . Brian also has books and soon to be released DVDs on Lulu.com., in the event the internet gets shut down, or censored...
CHANGE HELL TO HEAVEN ON EARTH. WE MUST ALL BELIEVE IN CHRIST JESUS, GOD INCARNATE, IT IS BY FAITH THAT WE ARE REDEEMED, AND TURNING AWAY FROM SIN, AND SINNING NO MORE. JESUS WAS CRUCIFIED ON THE CROSS, FOR REMISSION OF SINS, Was RESURECTED. MARTHA MAGDALENE WAS PREGNANT WITH TWINS, JESUS' CHILDREN, WHEN HE WAS CRUCIFIED. THE TWO MAGDALENES, MARTHA AND MARY, THEY WERE TEACHERS OF THE WAY, AS I WAS ALSO FOR I AM MARY RUTH, SISTER TO JESUS. MARTHA MAGDALENE AND JESUS HAD TWIN BOYS TOGETHER. AFTER JESUS' DEATH THE TWO MAGDALENES GOT MARRIED, AND HAD CHILDREN. ONE SETTLING IN FRANCE, THE OTHER IN THE BRITISH ISLES, THESE TWO SISTERS SPREAD THE SEEDS OF THE HOLY GRAIL. BAPTISM IS BY TOTAL BODY IMMERSION. THE EUCHARIST IS OF HOLY COMMUNION, ACTUALLY MEANS HUMAN SACRIFICE @ THE HIGH MASS OF THE VATICAN. WE HAVE TO HAVE A QUANTUM MIND SHIFT TO THE CHRIST CONSCIOUSNESS, BY SILENT PRAYER, AND LIKE THINKING WE CAN CHANGE THE WORLD. LOVE ONE ANOTHER, BE OF SERVICE TO EACH OTHER, AND THOU SHALT NOT KILL. JESUS EATS NO PORK, AND ONLY ORGANIC MEATS, ANIMALS THAT WERE KILLED IN HUMANE WAYS, BY BEING PUT TO SLEEP BEFORE THEY ARE KILLED. HE ALSO OF COURSE EATS FRUITS AND VEGETABLES. WE HAVE BEEN ON A JOURNEY, TO PROVE OURSELVES, AND OUR LOYALTY TO YHVH/JESUS CHRIST OR SATAN/LUCIFER, THIS IS A TEST OF YOUR SOULS, TO ACHIEVE PERFECTION OF SOULS. WE ARE ALL REINCARNATED. HISTORY IS REPEATING ITSELF. THAT IS WHY YOU HAVE THE SENSE OF DE JAVU, AND HAVE CERTAIN DREAMS. WE ARE IN A TIME COMPRESSION OF OUR PAST LIVES RIGHT NOW, WE HAVE ALL MADE MISTAKES @ TIMES, BUT WE NEED TO NOW ESPECIALLY MAKE SURE THAT WE LIVE ACCORDING TO THE WAY JESUS LIVED AND FOLLOW HIS COMMANDMENTS. PROPHESY: GEORGE BUSH THE PRESIDENT IS THE 3RD ANTICHRIST, THE DEVIL, AS IS DICK CHENEY THE V.P. IS A DEMON. GEORGE BUSH SR. IS SATAN. HILARY CLINTON IS LILITH, THE FIRST WIFE OF ADAM WHO CONCEIEVED WITH THE FALLEN NEPHILIM, AND PRODUCED THE SEEDS OF CAIN. GOD TOOK LILITH AWAY FROM ADAM. ADAM THEN MARRIED EVE, THEN THE SEEDS OF SETH WERE STARTED, THE RIGHTEOUS SEEDS. THERE ARE MANY OTHER FALLEN ANGELS, BEASTS WHO ARE IN THE WORLD'S GOVERNMENTS, AND RELIGIONS. ILLUSION OF PEACE IN ISRAEL, LED BY THE TALMUDIC JEWS, THE COMPLETION OF THE TEMPLE MOUNT IN JERUSULEM. 11/14/2012 PRINCE CHARLES/LUCIFER ANNOUNCES THAT HE IS GOD ON EARTH, THAT HIS SON PRINCE WILLIAM IS THE SON OF GOD. THE SETTING UP BY THE VATICAN OF THE FALSE MESSIAH CHRISTS ON EARTH PRINCIPLE PLAYERS SANANDA MAITREYA, SANANDA JESUS, SANANDA ESU EMMANUEL, AND SANANDA ST. GERMAINE (THESE SANANDAS ARE DEMON POSSESSED). THE NWO ENDEAVOR TO CREATE THE ILLUSION OF PEACE ON EARTH, OF FALSE CHRIST'S RETURN, AND GOD ON EARTH. THE NWO THEN INTENDS TO CREATE ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT, AND RELGION LED BY THE VATICAN. ALL ORGANIZED RELIGIONS ARE THE WHORES OF BABYLON. THE VATICAN IS THE SYNAGOGUE OF SATAN. 12/21/2012, JUDGEMENT DAY WILL OCCUR, AS THE EARTH GOES THROUGH THE CROSSING WHEN THE SOLAR EQUATOR INTERSECTS WITH GALACTIC PLANE AXIS OF THE MILKWAY,GOING TO THE NORTHERN EDGE OF THE MILKYWAY.THE EARTH IS TRAVELIING @ 43,200 MPH, HEADING TO THE CROSSING, WHERE THE TRUE FOLLOWERS OF THE WAYS OF CHRIST JESUS,YHVH WITH THEIR FAITH, AND FOLLOWING HIS COMMANDMENTS WILL ASCEND, THE EVIL SATANIC BEAST SYSTEM WILL BE DESTROYED, SATAN, AND HIS MINIONS WILL BE THROWN INTO THE ABBYS AND LOCKED AWAY FOR 1,000 YEARS. THEY WILL THEN BE LET OUT ASKED AGAIN TO REPENT, IF THEY DON'T THEN THEY WILL BE DESTROYED. 1/11/2013 JESUS CHRIST TAKES THE THRONE OF GREAT BRITAIN, AND RULES THE WORLD, SETTING UP HIMSELF AS THE LEADER OF THE CHURCH, WITH ELECT WOMEN TO LEAD THE VARIOUS FELLOWSHIPS IN THE WORLD, AND TEACH THE WAY. PEACE, LOVE, WILL PREVAIL ON THE EARTH. WE WHO ARE TRUE BELIEVERS WILL LEARN THE SECRET ESOTERIC TEACHINGS OF JESUS.THERE WILL BE REASONABLE PROSPERITY FOR ALL, EQUAL DISTRIBUTION OF WEALTH. THE EVIL EMPIRES WEALTH WILL BE DIVIDED AMONGST THE TRUE BELIEVERS IN CHRIST. LIFE ON EARTH WILL BE PARADISE, CHILDREN, YOUNG ADULTS WILL AGE TO AGE 33, ALL OLDER ADULTS WILL HAVE THEIR AGES REVERSED TO 33, THERE WILL BE ETERNAL LIFE. AUSTRALIA WILL BE THE GARDEN OF EDEN, THE BREAD BASKET OF THE WORLD, SPREADING FROM THERE TO THE REST OF THE WORLD. PROPHECY @: firstname.lastname@example.org. GATHERING THE SAINTS, THE 144,000, REFLECTED IN THE 12 CONSTELLATIONS, WHICH ARE 12,000 SAINTS DEEP, EMAIL ME IF YOU HAVE AN IMPORTANT PAST LIFE REINCARNATION. BIBLICAL TRUTHSEEKER TEACHER OF THE WAY OF JESUS, WHO WAS A GNOSTIC, NAZARENE, AND ESSENE. THE ARAMAIC DEAD SEA SCROLLS ARE THEIR TRUE SCRIPTURE, PLUS ONLY A FEW CHAPTERS OF THE BIBLE, AND THE CONCORDANCE.
...View this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNiydR1gBg4 @ Michelle Nye You Tube subscriber site video entitled: 8 New Guinea 2424 Suva Fiji. Jesus Christ Royal family of Marshall, and their crest,with the Ermine, and the Tribe of Judah, with the Golightly Shield, which represents the Tribe of Judah. The Ulster Flag represented the Royal Family. The Tribe of Judah had blue eyes, blond hair, red hair, and brown curly hair. The 6 million skulls under the Vatican, are remains of the Angels of the Tribe of Judah. The various races occured after the fall of the tower of Babylon, when people were scatterred to the four corners of the world, their appearances changed from the climatic influences. Peace and Love,Truthseeker,(Reincarnation of Mary Ruth, sister of Jesus, teacher of the WAY)
Er....Happy New Year?
Given the fact that skeptics are only making meager progress toward our common goals in society let's think together about a long term strategy. Do we have one? Does anyone?
Here's one idea for him -- they can all finish kindergarten.
Harry "Obscene Phone" McCall makes this interesting plea:
This past Sunday night, the National Geographic Channel aired a program based on the documented facts that there were 42 failed attempts to kill Hitler in: 42 Ways to Kill Hitler.
While attempting these 42 failed assassinations to kill this monster; six millions Jews, Jehovah Witnesses and other "undesirables" died in Nazi concentration camps along with millions of civilians and hundreds of thousands of soldiers...
If there is a God seated on his Royal Throne in Heaven, why did he not let at least 38 of these assassination attempts succeed since the death of Hitler could have stopped the Nazi machine or the latter of the 38 attempts would have ended the war?
38 successful assassination attempts? Now that would indeed take a miracle (actually 37 miracles)!
Richard Carrier wins for calling Loftus' book "intellectual and thoroughgoing."
Hector "Dr. Stupid" Avalos wins for comments at http://www.verumserum.com/?p=1114#comments
Finally, Gold for a deconversion story recommended by Loftus, which includes these howlers:
I grew up as an hard-core fundamentalist, and have been slowing drifting secular since the beginning of high school. In sixth grade, my parents got rid of Aladdin due to Jasmine’s inappropriate garb. My church started playing contemporary music in the evening services, and as this form of music is displeasing to God, we changed churches largely for this reason.
Although this may be barely believable to many of you unless you also have been brainwashed at an old enough age to know better, I followed along willingly. "It will be worth it all, When we see Christ." In high school, I was not allowed to date.... When I was a senior, God told me who I was to marry...A year later, she married another.
But socially speaking, as I’m sure you could imagine, my freshman year at a public university was … interesting. Shortly before arriving, I had shaken off some of my crazier beliefs regarding moral standards regarding music and dating, but that didn’t stop me from asking questions like "who’s Jessica Simpson?" or having to go to urbandictionary.com to figure out if making out meant sex. I had been betrayed into living a miserably legalistic life with standards above and beyond the Bible. ...
...What I couldn’t admit was that the Bible didn’t make sense to me. Paul kept on making logical arguments that didn’t work. For instance, why couldn’t he just say women aren’t supposed to teach men and leave it at that in I Timothy 2? I could accept that. Why must he give the reason that man was formed first – what did that have to do with anything?...
I read the Bible, I studied the Bible, but this only discouraged me further. Fall 2007, I set up my schedule to read through the New Testament in a semester. I started with Matthew and for the first time, I decided to look up the context each time he quoted the Old Testament. This Bible study laid the foundation for one of my clearest reasons to disbelieve.
Another Apostate for Stupidity!
Zombie CE wins for this "refutation of Christianity":
"All this word which I command you, that shall ye observe to do; thou shalt not add thereto, nor diminish from it." (Deut 13:1)Seasanctuary gets even nuttier by assuming his uncertainty is universal:
ven if -- so far as God knows -- he is the ultimate being and nothing exists besides himself and his creation, it is still logically possible that God is ignorant but does not realize it. We humans are used to having known unknowns, but even without them there may be unknown unknowns.
Normative on why we shouldn't do textual criticism:
Textual criticism of a religious book is just plain absurd. It isn't supposed to make sense! Have you never read the book:
For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent. Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom: But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness; But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God. Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men. For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called: But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty. - I Corinthians 1: 18-27
You gotta have faith, baby! Stop trying to rationalize your religion. It's cool. It's not your fault.
stevec may win Platinum for this one:
Have you ever noticed that if you remove the "M" out of Qumran you get "Qu'ran". You just gotta love those superstitous simpletons.
Clubbaseal fails the epistemology test:
Honesty is far more reliable than belief. If you're honest, you have no need for beliefs. If you're honest, you won't fool yourself into thinking you know something when you really don't. If you're honest, your morals will come from within, and you won't need someone else to tell you what to think.
I wonder if he honestly believes that. He also said:
The so-called "laws of logic" have not shown a great deal of merit for me. I see no reason to hold onto them. There's no need to form any kind of belief. Not that that's denying them. Hey, if someone uses them better than I do in a proper technique, I have no problem with that. I don't need to form a rally to strike them from the books, or denounce them as blasphemous and immoral. They just don't hold great value for me. I tested them, at your request, but they haven't shown enough relevance to my life that I need to form any kind of judgment at all.
Dan Barker's bunch wins for posting this at a state capitol:
At this season of the Winter Solstice may reason prevail. There are no gods, no devils, no angels, no heaven or hell. There is only our natural world. Religion is but myth and superstition that hardens hearts and enslaves minds.
"Reason" to include nuttiness like the Christ myth, we suppose.
MikeWright, who may still be a parody, refutes the Resurrection:
I often stump the xians who post here on this issue. Here is a new devastating rebutal to the resurection which I recently came across and thought Id share.
When people get up in the morning they are often said to have risen from there sleep. Moreover when someone is fast asleep they are often said to be dead. Thus when people said that jesus is risen they simply meant that jesus woke up from a deep sleep.
My next point is that being crucified is pretty boring. Sometimes they would sing songs like on monty pytons life of brian to keep spirits up however this was not an option when only a few people were crucified. Thus jesus got bored being crucified, fell asleep and when he woke up everyone said 'he has risen'
Im not saying that this is definately what happened however a naturalistic explanation always trumps a supernatural explnation
patcleaver shows religio-historical understanding:
The concept of souls contradicts Judaism which believed in resurrection of the preserved body.
ENeGMA is at it again with this howler. He was told:
the statement "being does not come from nonbeing" is an incredibly basic belief and metaphysical proposition. I would argue that such a position is the default position, and that anyone who wishes to doubt this principle of metaphysics shoulder's the burden of proof.
To which he replied:
You can argue that all you want, but it's nothing more than argumentum ad populum and thus is logically fallacious. I can turn this around and so say no less of a philosopher than Hume thought it possible.
Neither you nor any of those philosophers whom you're depending on have (to my knowledge) come up with any definite proof of why something cannot come from nothing. And it'd really be quite a stunning proof, if it could be provided, as it would dissipate a lot of the force of the problem of induction.
As for an argument for the affirmative, I point to conceivability. I can conceive of something coming from nothing. I hold out my hand, and in it a frog appears, without any cause whatsoever. Where's the contradiction here?
David Steele, Fundy Atheist Moron Supreme, wins for this comment on The Impossible Faith:
I don't dispute that crucifixion would be considered dishonorable, but I don't think it would be beyond the mental scope of some Romans to accept that the crucifixion of an entirely innocent person, who then rises from the dead and is about to come back to rule the world and pay back all his enemies, would have its attractiveness. The disgrace and humiliation of the crucifixion probably contributed to the dramatic appeal of Christianity. The same principle is at work in a scripted wrestling match: the good guy is usually beaten and humiliated as much as possible, then turns the tables and comes out the eventual triumphant winner. From a marketing standpoint, this aspect is a plus.
Reader in school reports this response, the ultimate in postmodern travel, to his point that Scandanivia has no dictatorships:
you've never been there, you wouldn't know.
shunyadragin refutes the ontological argument:
Yes, fails miserably, same assumptions. Like Kalam it assumes God exists. If we can conceive of a God, that God must exist. If I can conceive of unicorns, elves, pink flying elephants and dragons, they must exist.
mosabdullah wins as a non-Christian theist for this comment:
The Quran was revealed around 500 years before Aristotle.
Another Muslim, sief, vies for non-Christian theist Platinum:
www.carm.org (The Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry) propagates the message of christianity at the same time maligns other religions like Islam. See how gently these people let the cat out of the bag and confirm the Quranic verse.
The Glorious Quran says.
"That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah.;- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:-" (Quran 4:157)
Conjecture i.e Guesswork, fiction.
The above Quranic verse says that whoever differs in the matter of crucifixion and agrees that Christ (pbuh) was crucified are actually following conjecture(Guesswork,fiction).
See how Carm.org confirms the Quranic verse.
"The Bible contains many different styles of writing such as poetry, narration, fiction, history, law, and prophecy and must be interpreted in context of those styles. It is the source of the Christian religion in that the Bible contains the words of God and how the Christian is to apply the words of God to his life."
Source : http://www.carm.org/seek/Bible.htm
So carm.org agrees that the bible contains fiction.
Thank You for confirming the Quranic verse.
Dispen4ever surrenders reason for Christians:
I agree that the unbeliever just won't get it, but perhaps they'll check out the verse referenced and see the light. It is part of Christian witnessing, from my POV. And circular reasoning for the Christian, making the statement or claim or quoting of scripture and then referring to the Bible is at the very heart of Christian Truth. Circular reasoning is the gem that we Christians all see our reflection in
Textual criticism of the Bible is just plain absurd. It is impossible to understand it, intellectually.
gjpogiatzis speculates on the antichrist (sample) and noms Platinum:
outside Bible: types of the Antichrist:
-Santa Claus a.k.a. Satan Claws a.k.a. Kriss Kringle from "Christkindl" "the little Christ child" a.k.a. St. Nick related to "Old Nick" a name for Satan (I'm not crazy; Satan "transforms himself into an angel of light" & "deceiveth the whole world"; Santa resembles him & God in many uncommon ways), the popes
-gods (ex. "virgin-born" Buddha [god to some], Crishna the chief Hindu god, Confucius, Hercules)
-writers/philosophers (ex. Socrates-"virgin-born" Plato-Aristotle, Shakespeare [secretely mentioned in Psalm 46in association with the #666], Immanuel Kant, Nietzsche),
-political leaders (ex. "virgin-born" Alexander the Great, Julius Caesar, Genghis Khan ["Lord of the Universe," related to "Cain"], Napoleon, Hitler, Lincoln who died on Good Friday & JFK who both suffered a "fatal head wound" like the Antichrist [Rev. 13:3], George Bush, Barack Hussein Obama),
-movie stars (especially ones who played God or Satan, like Willem Dafoe, Jim Carrey, & Jack Nicholson),
-heroes/villains (Batman, Spider-Man, Harry Potter, Frodo Baggins, James Bond, Superman; Achilles, Odysseus, Aeneas,...),
-music stars (Elvis ["God-power"], Jim Morrison of the Doors, John Lennon of the Beatles,...)
-and many more
"America's Pastor" Rick ("powerful leader") Warren ("a place where rabbits abound," & rabbits/bunnies/hares are symbols of Satan & his demons, as you can see if you do research on what they are associated with) will speak at the inauguration of Barack Hussein Obama-Biden (compare Iraq Hussein Osama BIn laDEN) is a type of the false prophet of Rev. 13:11-18who causes the whole world to worship the Antichrist & who appears as innocent as a "two-horned lamb" but "speaks as a dragon [Satan]" by teaching millions through books like his wildly successful "The Purpose-Driven Life" that you can be "worldly" & "selfish" and still be a Christian and avoid Hell, and that you don't need to fear God although the Bible teaches that "fear of God causes departure from evil" (Proverbs 16).
----Bugs Bunny called "HareDEVIL Hare"; "DEVIL as a three-legged hare"; The hare in African folk tales is a trickster; some of the stories about the hare were retold among African slaves in America, and are the basis of the Brer Rabbit stories. The hare appears in English folklore in the saying "as MAD as a March hare". In Irish folklore the hare is often seen as an evil creature, principally associated with witches. Many cultures, including the Indian and Japanese, see a hare in the pattern of dark patches [also seen to represent Cain the first murderer in Dante's Paradiso Canto 2] in the moon [symbol of Satan]...Jack [Satan's name] Hare; the Easter Bunny is Christ's chief opponent on Easter as Santa Claus is on Christmas; Rick Warren ["a place where rabbits abound"] the false prophet who will speak at Obama's inauguration; Playboy Bunny (you can Google for these discoveries yourself)
We'll include his site as part of this nom: http://www.primaryproofsofchristianity.com/ which has gems like:
CARS & VIDEO GAMES, which lead people to worship the "heroes" like Batman mentioned above!: Jaguar, Mercedes (name for the paganized Virgin Mary), Super Mario ("star of the sea"- the name of the paganized Virgin Mary who is worshipped like Mario; originally was a carpenter like Jesus!) the most famous of video game heroes even today, etc., Link (related to Lincoln!) the elf-like creature (related to the elves which serve Santa Claus a.k.a Satan Claws) of The Legend of Zelda, Sonic ("extremely fast," like a sound wave, & as "God is light" [1 John 1]!) the Hedgehog, Donkey Kong (related to "King Kong" & "Master Kong" the name of Confucius!) the ape, Solid Snake of Metal Gear Solid (like Satan "that ancient serpent" [Rev. 12:9])
---the "whore [& "queen"] of Babylon" of whose "wine" "all the nations drink": Princess Toadstool a.k.a. Princess Peach, who has a fortune of over $1 billion & who is from among the seven Mushroom Kingdoms of the eight kingdoms of Mushroom World as "the whore of Babylon" sits on seven hills which represent seven kingdoms, which culminate in the eighth one ruled by the Antichrist!
Mario & his chief adversary Bowser the horned turtle-dragon (like Satan; he is even "the eighth king" of the last of the eight kingdoms in Mushroom World as Satan/the Antichrist is said to be in Rev. 17!) over the "lake of fire" which Nintendo fanatics must beware
John Goddard may have been drinking again:
Figures, another atheist that doesn't know USA is just a workspace for Gentile Noahides to rebuild Jewish Israel in the name of Caesar
How much of an idiot doesn't know that the Masons built USA, are devoted to Hiram who built Solomon's Temple, and that Solomon was devoted to gods of Tyre who increased his wealth and women?
1 Kings 10:14Now the weight of gold that came to Solomon in one year was six hundred threescore and six talents of gold,
Which is secularism at its finest.
Hiram is the Masons of USA and False Prophet Jezebel of Revelation that seduces Jews to Satan.
Atheists and Christians alike are like little babies slobbering patriotic over the USA when it is nothing but Jezebel.
caspian reneges the Trinity with this reading of 1 Cor. 1:24:
Christ is the power and wisdom of God in the sense that the Father delegated power and wisdom to Christ. Trinitarianism's interpretation, making Christ "the brains AND the braun of the outfit", leaves the Father as... what? A holding company? It is then said we can't separate them.. but yet we're told they are three "persons". What exactly is meant by "three persons" -- three aspects?
jeremyguru likewise shows theological and logical sophistication:
The trinity is a remnant of Judeo/Christianity's polytheistic influences.
Your opinion about what the trinity means is no more correct/incorrect than any other christian interpretation. The trinity is a stupid idea, a contradiction...nonsense. You christians fight about it all the time.
However, I've heard many Christians claim that Yahweh and Jesus are the same being, so I'll stick with that.
15thnametried brings us the Worst Ever Grasp of Atonement:
Jesus died for our sins? Why is there still sin then? Seems to me that his being here to 'die for our sins' didn't do much good.
For Rob Bell, as recorded at http://www.alittleleaven.com/2008/04/rob-bells-comme.html This site records plenty of screwiness in Christianity.
http://newsbusters.org/blogs/rich-noyes/2008/12/01/msnbc-anchor-frets-why-hasn-t-obama-s-election-ended-terrorism -- At Large Platinum nominee.
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread418572/pg1 -- actually, most of the people on the site deserve an award.
Several Mormons win at http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showthread.php?t=121873
For the parents at http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081217/ap_on_fe_st/odd_hitler_cake
Reader nominates this site, which may well deserve Christian Platinum: http://wearefishermen.com/home.html
http://www.womenonthegrow.com/ for too much feelgoodism