Ya know what? When it comes to toons, you can't give these guys an inch. Seriously. When I moved the Screwball feature over here from tektonics.org, I figured it'd be a simple thing, but NOOOOOO! The toons got one look at it and instantly led a coup to take it over. It was too DULL, they said. Needed some funny graphics they said.


Well, they threatened to walk out on me if I didn't give it over to 'em to manage, so here we are. Bah. And to think Shrike Team #2 was ALMOST 77 blank pages.

There's an old canard that goes like this:

  1. God can't die.
  2. But Jesus died.
  3. So Jesus can't have been God.
  4. So there too, nanny nanny boo boo.

Your average cultist isn't going to solve things like this with concepts like hypostases, of course, but in the meantime they're good for a laugh, like this one who wrote in:

If Jesus were God then how could Jesus have died, you forget God can't do 2 thing's lie or die. If Jesus didn't die then we have no hope for salvation Jesus was made a curse for us, for cursed is any man hung on a pole, so If Jesus were God then your saying God cursed himself, and it pleased him to bruise himself and God was made sin to die for sin lol God sacrificed himself to himself , lol

Jesus is equal with God yes, but Jesus isn't equal TO God.

equal with--- 2 in a task to save many Jesus loved as God loves

equal to-- 2 God's , God ,said there is no other god but me, none before me, beside me and none formed[ flesh] after me, God doesn't become what he created[ formed]

GOD ISNT, NOR WILL EVER BE A MAN, man is supposed to become like God

God doesn't change

trinity was not part of the early church [ real church]

You can just smell the Kool-Aid on that boy's breath. Meanwhile for the first time in a while I got a "Disturbed Da Vinci Code" reader email:

Idiot. Read the book a little closer and try not being so ready to throw it under the bus. Mary's tomb was not supposed to be full of "documents" disproving Christianity, but she was meant to be THE Holy Grail. That's the problem with you dipsh** religious jackasses. You have no sense of humor, only read what you want to read and have a problem with dissenting opinion. Religion is crap and so is the whole of the Church.

I hadn't heard from Dennis McKinsey's Wild Bunch in a while; here's one, of the "Incompetent and Unaware of It, And Blissfully Happy About It" School:

Sir James! I'm Gary DeVaney thegodmurders.com website.

I read your blurb on C. Dennis McKinsey's Biblical Errancy. I can see a dozen reasons why YOU wouldn't buy Dennis' books at any price. It is not his excellent scholarship you take issue with. It's Dennis himself. Dennis is not the topic of his scholarship. I started my Biblical investigation in 1982 and had transcribed my findings before I became aware of Dennis' monthly newsletters in the early 90s. I ordered and paid for his $53 BE book 6 months before it was released. I did the same with his second book that sold for over $100. Not much got past me = I thought. But - Both of Dennis' books showed me how much did NOT jump off the Bible pages as I thought I hast captured most of it.

Since 1995, I have been on Dennis' BE panel and we answer all who inquire. Most believers get nothing of content from his C&V issues. They just want to demonize Dennis instead of verifying the C&Vs.

Your comments head off believers who care to normally inquire. Why not let them think for themselves?

And here's one of those sound arguments I get once in a while in response to the over 1600 articles on the Tekton website:

if there really is a god, and he really wants miserable pieces of sh** like you in heaven, all i can say is - you deserve each other.

And for a really intellectual exercise in rebuttal, try this one:

I can change the word home into the word barn in just a few moves, by simply changing one single letter at a time. Each time I change a letter, it will form another whole real word. You've heard of these little brain teasers, haven't you? I think most adlts have. Well, that's what you, and most christians are doing, when you are slowly twisting the words of the bible to make it mean something other than what it so plainly reads. And the really sad part is, that most of you actually believe you are doing the right thing. Pathetic. I feel sorry that you are still so disallusioned.

Then from the Christian side, we close with these two scroogies. This was the entirety of one letter I got:

Watch for the 7 rings of fire

Daniel Joseph 3

Watch why? Is he going to jump through them?

And here's one from the "I'll Never Miss It" Department:

I will no longer link to your website since it has been drastically changed. In the past, I referenced to your website since it had great information on the "authenticity of Daniel"

If you want to have a link re-established, then you can write me. But I also want to be linked to as well.

Well, I never knew the guy linked to me in the first place, and as far as I know no one found me through him, sooooo...one more tragic severance, I suppose....

Don't Pull Their Tails Off Or It'll Set Off a Nuke

Remember last year's great Screwball Award for the website that claimed that the Jesuits were lizards in disguise? Well, one of our readers posted a link to that somewhere and a Nobel Laureate named "Dennis" replied with some comments:

Diet and sexual dimorphism in the very catholic lizard genus Leiocephalus of the Bahamas.

leio is latin for smooth, cephas is aramaic for rock, (Peter, the foundation of the church), phallus is greek origin into latin.

the rock of cybele was moved from phrygia to rome, and is known in the church as cephas, it is a natural radio crystal that allows for the amplification of telepathic communication, which is the foundation of the catholic church, even though they are all trained to lie about it. if you know what you are doing you can listen in and monitor whatever you want.

the test of occult practice is whether you can fool the people so completely they can't see the truth even when you give it to them. i'm sure that in the medical and scientific latin vocabulary there is more stories right out in the open.

i have been watching the catholic priesthood for several years now and know that they sacrifice children on saturday night, and practice "black tantric left hand techniques, for the purpose of raising kundalini", which is sex based black magic based in the belief of capturing the immortal soul of your torture victim. it is the technique of creating a sex addicted sociopath within the structure of a peer group.

i have uncovered allegorical passages in the new testament that refer to tantric technique, and emasculation of Jesus.

the catholic church hierarchy began as the priesthood of the mystery cults of rome. the cult of cybele and the rites of bacchanalia give the most obvious connection to the current indoctrination of the priesthood. they rose up and joined numbers at a time when the jewish nation was weak after losing a revolt and the roman economy was on the rocks, partly because of internal destabilizing by the catholics.

this is an article of a current trial of a priest that sacrificed a nun on holy saturday:


in the new testament it says that the eyes are the windows to a mans soul. if you look into the eyes of a person who is conscious (enlightened) the eyes are light or have a glow.

a priests eyes are black reflecting the evil sex based gluttony of being conscious in the lower earth based chakras.

these idiots are subhuman, exhibit blunted emotions, no problem solving skills and display the morals of a sex addicted sociopath. all the illuminati and all the other outerspace lizard [poop] is a way for them to make you think that this super race is out there, there is nothing you can do about it because the conspiracy is underway, when in reality, it's just disinformation posted on the net by a [homosexual] priest down the street, and it's pretty easy to do something about it because these retarded morons are scared to death of normal human beings, and when exposed, explode into a cloud of fear. 911 is tracable to the vatican as is aids. if you back them into a corner they start admitting crimes in order to float there self esteem as their delusional self image starts to fade away. the cult indoctrination is so demanding that they must be stripped of any identity to get in, they then harvest self esteem by exploiting the normal people around them.

a catholic lay person is the first level of indoctrination, as they believe that the priest is a viable authority figure commensurate to God, next thing you know, God starts handing out self esteem. each lay person is held in control by blackmail. a priest watches his flock until a person is caught doing something they would'nt dare want the community to know, more often then not, a sin is suggested to them by the very person that records the activity for future discipline. kinda like the structure of the cia.

the catholic church consists of etheric structures, (thought forms) constructed between individual's chakras so one person can moniter and influence another, actually whole congregations. what the church does is open one for audible comunication, keep the others closed for subliminal suggestion (subconscious, the angel and devil on your shoulder, is actually your priest.) if you are learned, all chakras are open so you can't be inadvertantly influenced. the following is the first paragraph from a vatican disinformation page the vatican posted 1 day after i posted my above 1st post. it is an attempt to provide for an explanation beyond the fact that it just the catholic church involved in this behaviour.

reference: the Etheric Double and the Astral Body by Aurthur Powel, these books will outline the knowledge needed. all the church does is use routine knowledge of physics against people who are ignorant because their chakras are closed.


Almost everyone on this planet has at least 5 implants,( they are installing approximately 10 in everyone as i write this) especially in America..... the Dracs and their other lizard helpers the Greys, have developed a new method of shooting darts in 4-D at us... and therefore implanting people rapidly.. this is my story which relates to others who have been taken over by the lizards....fortunately i have about 3 major helpers who continually help me take out implants or neutralize them.... from the beginning of my life i knew i would be implanted... when i was a little girl my mother would put curls into my hair and she always ran across the implant on my right ear. That has remained to this day.......i have tried to remove it without success,as the implant moves....

Recently because i have been such a threat to them of exposure, they have tried to take me over completely like they have done to many of our leaders...( Senators, Congressmen, Military, Business -Corporate heads, etc.... and especially MEDIA controllers... although some of them are shapeshifter Dracs....like Rupert "Wotz his MUR-Dak name?" ) What i'm going to do is describe what i believe to be the major process to INSTALL A LIZARD INSIDE A PERSON TO HAVE TOTAL CONTROL....MY HOPE IS THAT WHEN THIS IS EXPOSED

Well, wasn't THAT refreshing.

Troll of the Year, Every Year

TheologyWeb welcomed a new pseudo-Christian troll recently signed in under the name of "JoLonda". He (she?) produced a raft of award-winning comments we'd like to share, so that he/she can get some royalties to pay for some much-needed medication:

In my experience, I see a lot of people severely limited by their personal foolishness, lack of awareness, and inaction in the face of opportunity. Many of these losers wind up in "The Ministry."

Here are some probable reasons why they cannot find a real job:

1.) They get hooked on the free ride provided by charitable giving. Such a systyem of giving is nicely perpetuated by calling their gifts, love offerings, free will offerings, tithes, special gifts, faith promises, "your best gift," "support for God's work," and any other label which seems to fly.

2.) As is easily seen by their gradeschool level of pulpit speaking, these guys are not that bright, and would probably, and most likely have been, ousted from real workplaces.

3.) There are not many other positions where they get to wear a suit, have a title, their own desk and phone, a few people to be in charge of, get special tax breaks, get lots of sympathy from nice little old ladies, can blame a lack of money on someone else, do no real labor, and have some kind of ex officio respect.

4.) For the actual time on the job, minus travel, meetings, phonecalls, and nonperformance tasks, they actually get some decent scratch.

5.) They are a part of a real backscratching group of peers. They never are required to break the brotherhood for the sake of Godly principles, but can always claim their duty to maintain "Unity" in the Body of Christ.

6.) If any particular position does not work out because of personal insufficiencies, or stupidity, as is common, all they have to do is move on. There will always be some congregation somewhere that will like their style of putting on the preach.

7.) A lot of junior guys, like "Youth Leaders," are really stuck in their spot, especially if they are kinda short, or not bright enough to play the Head Pastor game. Nobody likes a short little guy on his tiptoes peering from over the top of the pulpit.

8.) And a lot of youth leaders like to be a little emperor in their special group of kids. It is better to have some power over a few weak and gullible people, than no power in the real world.

9.) If a career church guy does decide to try to get a real job, he knows that if his employment resume says "Former Pastor," the HR people kinda go, ("Yah..., Okeyyy. This guy cannot make it as a preacher, what is he doing here....?") Then they say, "You sound very qualified, but we do not have anything at this time. We will keep your application on file. Alright? Thanks!" ("In the round file, clown.")

10.) And finally, they know after a being some kind of a big dog in their church, they will never get the same strokes trying to be a regular, working guy, having to face the real world.

Let me know if you know of any other reasons which Professional Church Guys cannot get a real job.

Did you know that the "Education" of pastors consists of nothing significantly more than reading, listening to people talk, and learning how to talk "Preacherese?" All just a lot of words and ideas.

Apparently some types of medication don't work on trolls.

Richard Carrier Offers TWO Reasons Why Atheism is More Rational

This just in from the natural anti-theology department. One of our fellow apologists recently reviewed a book by SecWeb Superschlep Richard Carrier, in which he noted "Richard's argument that breasts are evidence for the nonexistence of God":

[F]emale breasts do not need to be large, or prominent at all-as instruments for nursing, small breasts are just as effective, while large breasts create increased strain on a woman's back and increased risk of injury and lethal malfunctions like cancer. . . . [T]hey are a liability, a needless waste of energy. . . . What possible use such an inefficient tactic would have in the eyes of an intelligent engineer is hard to fathom.

And, our colleague noted, "Oddly enough, he dedicates his book to 'Jen . . . My buxom brunette.' " Hmm. Let's ask our own buxom Annabelle Ketterling (Snowdrop) what SHE thinks of Richard's argument. Annabelle?

Carrier also collects an egotism bonus for the following self-evaluation:

At the very least, Wood cannot argue against the fact that I am no less a philosopher than Aristotle or Hume. My knowledge, education, and qualifications certainly match theirs in every relevant respect.
And They Also Bought Their Ph D From Wal-Mart

"Lazy Agnostic" has still not learned his lesson, and so wins gold for continuing to insist that certified anthropological fact is apologetic fiction, where ritual purity in the OT is concerned:

Of course, it makes more sense to consider that the authors of the OT were basing their prohibitions on trial & error health concerns. Isn't the concept of "ritual purity" an apologetic device to cover for what amounts to the ancient pathogenic ignorance and the needless mysogyny of a supposedly omniscient and all-loving deity?


Resurrection by Industrial Light and Magic

"Shunydragon" offered the following explanation for the resurrection appearance in which Thomas had a look at the holes in Jesus' hands:

Actually self mutilation is not uncommon in religious movements. I saw this several times in Latin America among Christians.

Actually Jesus was not always so clearly recognized. This scenario could easily have been worked out by a good PR spin doctor, and a little makeup and special effects.

Puff wasn't the only one winning gold on this topic. A new troll named "Provoker" earns some too, for comments on that and a bunch of other stuff, of which, we have these choice tidbits:

This passage has been added, or edited, by Bishops of the universal religion of the Roman empire, for 2 reasons: (1) It was politicly expedient that the dead Jesus be seen as a spiritual king over a spiritual kingdom, and (2) it was necessary to cover up the fact that Thomas was Jesus' twin brother.

The true message, and focus, of the apostolic church was the good news that the Davidic kingdom is going to be resurrected, and Jesus had been executed, to prevent him from attempting it, and Jerusalem was destroyed, to stop the apostolic(Zealot) church from attempting it.

Over the 250 years following the destruction of Jerusalem, the "underground" church became completely divided through the introduction of pagan doctrines which the Romans were more familiar with, and when Constantine brought the church into the open, he unified it with a democratic vote...the pagan doctrines won the day, and the rest is church history.

If "the crucifixion" took place in Joseph of Arimethea's own garden, as one of the gospels states, then the crucifixion and resurrection was probably a staged representation of the death of the covenant kingdom of Israel, the burial of the everlasting(old) covenant, and the good news of the coming resurrection of the covenant kingdom of Israel from the dead, in which case all the problems you suggest, would simply have been part of the act. What do you think?

I have noticed that many Christian bible scholars have a tendancy to dismiss pre-first century scripture, and put more faith in post first century BC scripture. Pre-first century scripture obviously has seniority, and was obviously the only scripture that Jesus and his apostles used to preach the gospel.Post first century BC scripture was under the complete control of Romans, virtually from the time it was written, while pre-first century scriptures were well established, well known, and well travelled, long before Jesus and the apostles used them to preach the gospel, and long before Romans even had an interest in scripture.Why is there an obvious Christian bias against pre-first century scripture?

I'm not sure what the difference is between a scholar, and a "real" scholar, but I use the word "scholar", meaning anyone who reads with the intention of learning.

What is inconsistent here? Scholars were around long before colleges were, and people with scholarly qualifications are not necessarily scholars, but are more likely to be memorizers of some scholars opinions...LOL

Pay a Dollar More and He'll Also Take Communion

You can sell anything on Ebay, right? But for pure screwiness, try this offer seen recently:

What Happens When They Run Out of Cherry Kool-Aid?

Moving back to nutty Christians, we have an award for Pastor Doyle Davidson, whose story is told here:

The pastor of a charismatic Christian church attended by the Plano mother on trial, accused of fatally cutting off the arms of her 10-month-old daughter, told jurors Wednesday that mental illness is really demon possession that cannot be cured with psychiatry or medicine.

"I do not believe that any mental illness exists other than demons, and no medication can straighten it out, other than the power of God," said Doyle Davidson, the 73-year-old minister of the Water of Life Church that Dena and John Schlosser attended several times a week.

Davidson also testified that he has cast demons out of parishioners and seen evil spirits, including one that was 6 feet tall with a long tail. The former veterinarian, who has no formal religious training, has a cable TV show in the Dallas area and several states.

A police report states the pastor was in the home of another married member of his congregation, sitting on top of her and trying to choke out evil spirits.

Davidson told jurors that God had pledged the woman to him and that demons were keeping them apart, but he denied he was drunk or was trying to choke her.

Hmmm. Better send Pastor D the answer he needs -- a copy of The Purpose Driven Life. That'll stop any heresy.

A fellow styled "Logos" on a certain forum wipes up with the Roman Piso Lookalike Award for his thesis that "Josephus and Paul were the same person" based on the following:

1. Both of them were Pharisees.

2. Both were hellenistic Jews.

3. Both are known for their literary works, and both produced their works with upper-class Koine greek.

4. Josephus tells that he knows many ancient dramas. In acts, there's an episode that narrates Paul's conversion, and the saying "hard to kick against the goad" which has its origin in a drama (written by Jospehus himself?), is used.

5. Paul (paulos) means "small". Josephus mentions Mathhias Curtus as his forefather. Curtus means "small".

6. Paul was in his famous shipwreck when he was on his way to Rome. Josephus also mentions that he was shipwrecked when on his way to Rome.

7. Both were in Rome during the well-known fire in 64CE

8. Paul spent 2 years in inprisonment in Caesarea when waiting for his trip to Rome. Josephus was inprisoned for 2 years during the Jewish war in 67-69CE and he was apparently kept in Caesarea. He too ended up in Rome.

9. Paul disappears into desert for three years after the Damascus incident. Josephus mentions that he had been in the desert with a hermit named Banus for a period of three years when he was young.

10. After the Jewish war, Josephus became a traitor in the eyes of the Jews, and he lived in Rome, apparently for reasons of safety, and wrote his apologies. Paul became a traitor and a 'renegade of the law' in the eyes of the Jews, and there were many attempts to kill him.

Meanwhile, MichaelCadry collects his monthly stipend as usual, this time under the heading of the Omnipresent Prophecy Award:

You haven't said much of what I disagree with, so that is good. When the Lord God sends the sign He will that I was telling the truth, then and only then, shall you believe.

Did you see that incredibly bright star in the south-southeastern sky this morning. It MUST be a sign of His Second Coming. Even the angel that spoke to me was not as shining.

(By the way -- that's the planet Venus. It's been there for a while.)

I have been praying to God that He beat the all-time record of Phoenix having no rain. Looks like it's gonna be this Saturday. I hope that is enough for you all, but I know for some, probably not. You are a very hard bunch of people, like nothing will penetrate your hearts. I don't know what else to do. It says that these two witnesses have power that it rain not in the days of their prophecy, but it doesn't say that these two also have power that it rain to boot. You are misunderstanding the Scriptures. Do you think that God will not send rain for 3 and 1/2 years?? That is not the correct translation of the Scriptures and you are believing in vain.

I care about all of you whom I write here and I am not a mental case either. I have had many things happen to me in my life and generations that follow me shall call me blessed. I would not trade my life with anyone, for I have already gone through the good and bad times. I see an extremely bright star in the eastern sky 2 hours before dawn, and it is either a satellite or the sign of Jesus' Second coming. It is 3 times more brilliant than Venus. I have called two weathermen and they don't know what it is so far. I am hopeful.

It's okay that we make mistakes. You don't have to believe me. I don't expect you to. It is written in Daniel ( and I shall shew you what is noted in the Scripture of truth, and none shall hold with me in these things, except Michael). My guardian angel is Michael and I am his earthly voice on this earth. Jesus was His Father, Jehovah's voice on this earth, etc. The names Jesus and Jehovah (and Joshua, etc.) are all the same name, just different pronuncaitions.

Well now. To help Mike out a bit, let's suggests some Possible Future Signs and Wonders (TM) of Michael Cadry:

  • A dog eats some grass.
  • Heavy fog in London, England.
  • Baboons' buttocks being bright-red and prominent.

PitchforkPat wins his expected Fundy Atheist Delusion Award for a variety of statements, such as those on God "orchestrating rape" (see him get owned by a scholar here) as well as screwy comments like these:

It seems that very often when I, or others, raise an objection to a specific passage in the Bible, a very popular answer suggests a mistranslation or that the passage in question doesn't really mean what it appears to be stating. When you start adding these mistranslations up the Bible begins to appear quite unreliable, so it makes one wonder if it's the wrong version that's being used and if there's any that can be truly relied upon. While I realize that many here do not adhere to a literal translation, I would still like to here some opinions on what Bible constitutes the most reliable translation.

Further, I would like to know if anyone considers any Bible to be in fact accurately translated. If no Bible can be said to be reliably translated, it does make me wonder why, when the Bible states "God is not the author of confusion" that he would not provide us with at least one reliable translation of his word.

Especially when it comes to the authors of the books of the Bible, one of the seminal forces of misogyny. Of course it had to be Eve's fault that "sin" entered the world. If a woman has sex before marriage she is to be stoned to death. Not so a man. And of course we have Paul's classic admonition for women not to speak in church.

Apparently Pat must've skipped Romans 5:12.

LakeGeorgeMan earns the Walk on the Wild Side Award, first for joining the Christ Myth camp, and also for these comments which include a subscription to that old canard we mentioned earlier:

The word "god" as used by FS in the OP of this thread is clearly biased. He is using it to refer to the Westernized, Christianized concept of a monotheistic, creator of the universe, omnimax, personal deity. That's what he means when he says the word god. That's how he's been programmed. Christians like to use the word god as a brand name. The word "god" means something entirely different to a pantheist or ancient Greek polytheist.

If Christ was an immortal god, then by definition, he could not die. Thus he never really rose from the dead, because he never really could be dead. Thus the whole concept is incoherent.

If Christ was an immortal god-man that really lived on this planet and somehow really could "die" and then really "rose from the dead", in a physical body, then where is he? Why isn't he still here? If he "left", how did he leave? Why would he leave? Where did he go? How did he get there?

The simple answer is it is a made up story.

If you take time to develop your own argument for me about why I should not believe in the resurrection of Osiris or the Heaven Gate's cult members who comitted suicide, then you will have your answer.

And yet another Tasty Kool-Aid Award for Kim Miller and his Concerned Christians cult (not to be confused with concernedchristians.org), who says things like:

For those of you who do want to serve the Lord, don't be deceived by the amateurish and pathetic fabrication of a continually repeated story that I predicted an earthquake would strike Denver, Colorado, in the United States, in October of 1998. Individuals opposed to me, and the media in opposition to me, contributed to, participated in and delighted in the wickedness of manufacturing and / or perpetually repeating the earthquake lie for the purpose of publicly striking at the very issue of whether or not I am a prophet of the Lord. I am not only a prophet of the Lord; I am the prophet of the Lord, the direct spokesman for the Lord. The Lord speaks to me mouth to mouth, as he did with Moses.

And now it's time to see who's been stinking up the Web lately. Our first malodor is "Troy" over at Biblocality.com, who runs a forum in which it takes the average person only two messages to get banned. You won't find it hard to see why once you have a sample of Troy's screwiness:

" . . . Inquire not after their gods, saying, How do these nations serve their gods?" (Deut. 12.30b). Do not inquire after other gods through curiosity. God forbids us to make such an investigation for this will only lead to following the ways of the nations. What agreement has the temple of God with idols? "Nor take their names (other gods) upon my lips" (Ps. 16.4). Even on the pulpit we should be careful not to mention the names of other gods unless it is absolutely necessary for illustration.

It is already explained in the first post, even in the first sentence. In other words, do not move beyond the Spirit's leading to always defend yourself or your faith; this can be an idol for you which produces inordinate behavior. What often happens is those who have an apparent ministry in such work, make so many mistakes because they are overwhelmed by studying one group after another in their assessment of Christianity. Jesus often ran away and when forced with belligerent accusations said nothing. Some versions of the Bible even write in John 8.25, "Why do I speak to you at all?"

I for one have nothing to apologize for in my faith in Christ, so why do they? Christianity is solid and true, and needs no apologizing. I think it is Satan who brings in such words such as "apologetics" to confuse as though Christians in Christianity must apologize for something. It is not the case at all.

I can tell you lots of people think this about this word. And I can tell you also, that most apologetics sites are not very good, for they make a plethora of errors because they spread themselves too thin. Indeed, they need to apologize for their taking on more than they can chew. They are causing more problems then they are solving.

Think about it. Be careful you don't come up with lame excuses like "doing apologetics against apologetics" and propagating the same problem.

Apologizing for a false apology is lame! This is Satan's work. This is a self-refutation just like saying it's true there is no truth, using your words, to compare, to show it is like saying it is ok to be falsely sorry for being wrongly sorrowful. This does not represent the absoluteness of truth which is like a pillar; the objectivity of truth is unaffected by your bad choice of words, misreading the purpose of this thread, and the constant behavior of always apologizing with mistakes as we see exhibited in many apologetics sites seemingly apologizing and spreading themselves so thin they never touch anything deeply. At best these are carnal Christians.

It is just as wrong to say you are denominational as it is to say you are non-denominational. To say you are denominational is like say you are of Cephas or Apollos. This is wrong for God does not divide the church on persons.

It is also wrong to say you are non-denominational because that, the Bible says, is like saying you are of Christ, even dividing the body of Christ by saying you are of Christ and other Christians are not under your breath with a point of pride.

What is the solution? It is so easy I wish people could see, but alas, they will not for something blocks them, even as I was blocked for seeing for a time. For over 1900 years the blockage has been most apparent and will remain a blockage until men in Christ rise up to do something about it. It has started with seeds planted somewhere in a place almost none know about yet.

christianforums.com is not Christian though it is the largest forum on the internet today claiming to be Christian. It operates in the outward appearance of the kingdom of heaven, but its owner is not a born-again Christian, for he has no desire to accept authority in God's kingdom and will ban those with authority. Give me an opportunity to prove this by reading the rest and accept what God says, we shall know them by their fruit.

I have been banned no less than thirty times from this forum with no valid reason. Sometimes I am banned after 10 posts, other times after 150 posts. There is no consistency, except for one. Once they realize it is me, by my IP address, the banning takes place; and now, I am unable to even view the forum at all.

Some other website awards this round:

  • http://www.yourgoingtohell.com/ -- what would happen if Jack Chick did manga?

  • http://ruskosplanet.blogspot.com/ -- just the usual fundy atheism!

  • http://www.stjamesucclimerick.org/ -- I thought this was a Landover Baptist type parody at first, but sadly, it isn't. Check this content:

    Top 10 Reasons to check out the United Church of Christ

    10. What if church is like spinach...? You know, like something that you hated as a kid but you love as an adult because you eat it in ways that suit you much better. Guess what? A lot of people are having the same sort of experience with church . . . In the UCC, things are often quite different and worth checking out.

    9. Variety... UCC churches tend to tailor themselves to fit the people they feel called to serve in their local community. The result: A wide variety of musical traditions, expressions and values that have integrity and purpose. From conservative to liberal, we're not short on variety.

    8. No apologies... You are what you are...and so are we - we like ourselves just fine. Find a church where you will fit in, be nurtured and challenged to grow.

    7. No waiting... You don't have to join to be active in many UCC churches. If you want to get involved, many of our churches will find a place to help fulfill your need to give - whether or not you decide to join.

    6. No boxes -- God can blow the lid off any box, unfold it and turn it into a dance floor. We tend to be the "out of the box" people. Among our many firsts, we were the first mainline church to take a stand against slavery (1700), the first to ordain an African American person (1785), the first to ordain a woman (1853), the first in foreign missions (1810), and the first to ordain openly gay lesbian, bisexual, and transgendered persons (1972). We value education for all people. We founded Harvard and Yale, as well as many historically black colleges, six of which remain affiliated with the UCC to this day.

    5. One God, One Faith, One Baptism for All -- When we baptize you into our community, we promise that we will never take it back - no matter what you discover about yourself or what others discover about you along life's journey. We believe that baptism places each of us into the "body of Christ" and lasts forever. Some are baptized as infants, others as adults. Some are sprinkled. Others are immersed. Some reclaim their baptism from a previous church life. For each of us, however, baptism is big enough, strong enough and cleansing enough to last forever. We believe that everyone - old, young, straight, lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgendered, physically or emotionally challenged, rich or poor, sure or unsure, lost or found, Democrat or Republican has a place in the body of Christ. Baptism is like a badge that says, "you're a full member of the church and no one can take that away from you."

    4. Good News People -- We believe that No. 5 is good news!

    3. "Party" Church -- God is having a party and we are all invited. At God's party our spiritual hungering is fed and our thirsting is satisfied. At God's party we get strength, stamina and community support that helps us through the tough times that come to everyone. Feeding our spiritual hunger helps reduce those, "I can't believe I'm so stupid" moments - but we'll never eliminate them all. That's why we need friends and companions and not judges (no offense to judges) for the journey.

    2. Spiritual Guidance... It's not about commandments. It's about relationships - even with God. The most important relationship is our relationship with God. Second most important is our relationships with the rest of the human family. In balance, these relationships produce justice amid injustice, kindness in the face of meanness, and the humility of self acceptance that comes as we sense the presence of a God who knows our inmost thoughts and loves us uncontrollably - just as we are. Spiritual journeys can be like the exercise equipment we buy and leave under the bed. Without coaches and workout partners, most of us don't stick with it. We're the "Journeys Wanted" people . . . bring yours.

    1. We're waiting for you.

    In case you're wondering just how bad it is, consider this apology that also appeared on their website lately -- for apparently not recognizing that a quote was made not by Jesus, but by Satan! I didn't know exactly what that was about until a reader sent us a copy of the banner:

    For those of you who were kind enough to inform us about our previously inaccurate quote...we thank you! We were recently made aware that the former quote we had posted in the header on our site was actually not based on the word of Jesus but was a quote posed to him during his temptation. As soon as we were made aware of this we removed the quote from our site. We removed it...not hackers as some ill-informed bloggers would have you believe. This lesson is a demonstration why when using tools online to identify quotes that you think deliver the honest and sincere message you intended you should always view the quotes in their whole context.
  • losingmyreligion.com -- delusional fundy atheism with excuses attached. For example, consider how they reply to someone who may or may not have used our article on Mithraism as a source:
    Christian writes: Firstly, even the experts will acknowledge that there is virtually no literary evidence as to the beliefs of Mirthraism (please refer to "The Origins of the Mithraic Mysteries" by David Ulansey).]

    The experts? Experts are a dime a dozen. The experts at the Christian Institute for Creation Research declare that the earth is only about 6,000 years old. For every Christian "expert" on pagan religions, I can cite one who isn't a Christian and establishes that Mithra was a savior God who was worshipped prior to Jesus and whose origins date long before Jesus was supposed to have been born.

    This Christian can sing and dance and quote any number of books he wants. Here's what the Encarta online research source says about Mithra:

    It's so bad, they even quote askwhy.co.uk as a source! But check out even more excuses:

    (Christians say:) You are quoting Bible verses out of context. If you understood the times and the history surrounding the circumstances, you'd see it very differently.

    True. We are not Bible scholars, and do not pretend to understand the historical, cultural and linguistic background behind ancient texts. In addition, we are looking at ancient documents through multiple filters spanning time, culture, language, and our own biases, so hold no illusions that we (or the opposition) understand the Bible as it was originally penned.

    All this being said, we'd like to point out one thing: most evangelical Christians are in the same boat. They are not qualified Biblical scholars, nor are their clergy. They hurl their diatribes at society from a similar platform of Biblical misinformation. Our job, therefore, is to take their claims at face value, and judge them on their moral and ethical merits, rather than their Biblical accuracy. It is Christian beliefs and doctrines we take issue with, regardless of how Biblical or unBiblical they may be.

    (Christian say:) Why don't you try to understand the Bible more accurately then, instead of propagating the misinformation you accuse evangelical Christians of spreading?

    Though we respect the field of Bible history, it is of limited usefulness to the average person, because the understanding of ancient texts requires a level of training and academic facility beyond most people. But more importantly, untrained Christian practitioners abound. And the most vocal of these-- the ones through which our society at large encounters Christianity--are the evangelical types whose work you see dominating the media, college campuses and car bumpers. They include the world's largest Protestant denomination, and America's most influential Christian political organizations. These people, unfortunately, are the de facto interpreters of scripture. Their narrow, literalist view of the Bible, and the weird morality it creates, are what most of us understand Christianity to be. These Christians take their English-translated Bibles at face value, and draw moral and ethical conclusions straight from what they selectively read.

    In this arena, we are as qualified as they. We too can examine scripture on such a level, and weigh the resulting moral and ethical implications. Our fight, therefore, is against conservative, fundamentalist Christianity, which concerns itself more with faith and dogma, than ethics and reason, or academic accuracy.

    And so we suggest this slogan for them: "Fighting Fundy-Xtian Ignorance regardign the Bible with Fundy-Athiest Ignorance regarding the Bible, because truth and accuracy doesn't matter as much as PWNing xtians."

  • David Ben-Ariel defends Herbert W. Armstrong at http://ezinearticles.com/?Herbert-W...Time!&id=110620
    I'm often accosted by some who mindlessly cut and paste a list of Herbert W. Armstrong's "failed prophecies." I respond Herbert Armstrong was ahead of his time and served as an early warning system. What follows is one of these many exchanges:

    ...is it really enough to dismiss this written record as "being ahead of his time?"

    Yes. Why don't you just be honest and admit you hate Herbert W. Armstrong because he spoke the plain truth that CANNOT be refuted? that your traditional Churchianity is merely baptized paganism the Bible condemns as part of Mystery Babylon? For exposing your SUNday as a pagan counterfeit of the biblical Sabbath; your pagan holidays you've sought with your replacement theology to replace the biblical festivals; that sheeple like you bleat they're born again and don't have a clue what they're talking about, since we're born again at the Resurrection only; that God is not the sadist traditional Christians make Him out to be; that the meek inherit the Earth - not float off to Heaven; that you're not an immortal soul, eternal life is a gift from God; the wicked will be destroyed, ashes under our feet; we can become literal God-beings, members of the Kingdom-Family of God? Why don't you just confess and forsake your sins of murderous hatred against HWA for slaughtering your "sacred cow" and exposing it as religious bull from Babylon?

    Haven't I refuted Herbert Armstrong by showing his timing was off?

    No. The Apostle Paul also thought Christ would return in his lifetime. He was ahead of his time, as he, like Herbert W. Armstrong, later realized.

    Ugh. Somebody needs to be whacked with a preterism stick. And we have just the guy to wield it, right here....

  • http://www.geocities.com/b_r_a_d_99/index.html which says:
    Many Christians promote the theological position that any action God takes is always perfectly good and moral. To support this speculation, which they often advertise to the world as a universal fact, Christians implant a type of "moral" genetic code inside their God. This form of Christian reasoning rejects the idea that moral standards are an arbitrary function of God's power. They also reject the idea that there is a Law higher or outside of God.
  • http://www.christianitymeme.org/stand.shtml which says:
    The Christianity Meme is against abortion. Simply put, an aborted fetus is a missed opportunity to infect a new host. Instead, the Christianity Meme strongly supports intervention and religious indoctrination of mothers who are considering abortion. Such women are often at difficult times in their lives which makes them more susceptible to infection. (Not long ago, women who were pregnant out of wedlock were often sent to convents to bear their children. Without a doubt, religious (re-)indoctrination was also part of the program.) Through the parent-child bond, the Christianity Meme will likely be passed to the child, as well. For the Christianity Meme, this represents the potential infection two hosts for the effort of infecting one.

    Christianity claims to be in the business of saving souls (not necessarily saving lives). An aborted fetus represents a soul free from sin that will automatically go to heaven. The soul of an aborted fetus is already saved. (In fact, this may be the most efficient means of getting souls into heaven.) The Christian outcry over abortion is at odds with the stated objective of saving souls. Some Christians have even gone so far as to encourage violence toward abortion doctors. The infamous "baby butchers" web site is no longer up, but this site describes the controversy. The loud Christian outcry over abortion is much better explained by the Christianity Meme, that is missing out on a lifetime of influence over the unborn child. The objective of the Christianity Meme is aided by those people who are also sympathetic to the loss of a living (pre-)human.

    The message of the Christianity Meme is for Christians to "go forth and multiply" and "raise your children in the Christian faith". Birth control of any form is taboo, since it interferes with the propagation of the Christianity Meme. In fact, not long ago, masturbation, oral sex, contraceptives, the rhythm method, and homosexuality were all considered "crimes against nature" as they all interfered with procreation. The Christianity Meme has lost some territory in the arena of control over human sexuality. Isn't it ironic that as another life form, the Christianity Meme has so much control over humans' breeding. Should we really give so much control over our human destiny to an unconscious life form with its own agenda?

    While the Christianity Meme is neutral on the issue of gun control, Republicans, who are often True Christians, oppose gun control legislation. The Christianity Meme apparently benefits from massacres because they often create martyrs, fuel the cry for more religion, and "a return to Christian values". Both were outcomes of the recent Littleton High School shootings. See the news article " For the Right, Littleton's Tragedy became a 'Window of Opportunity'".

  • http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0094/0094_01.asp -- did you know that the forces of the Antichrist will be coneheads and wear spandex?
  • http://canadiancynic.blogspot.com/2006/02/dear-jinx-heres-your-chance-to-shine.html -- plenty more fundy atheism here!

  • Rellif -- It's pretty obvious to me that most of you who claim Mary to be the Mother of God are Catholic. You belong to the Pagan Catholic church. For one thing Yeshua wasn't devine, He was not God and He was not part of a trinity or One of Three Gods. He is not God incarnate, He was a man, born of a women who walked the earth almost two thousand years ago and who at Gods command became the worlds sin sacrifice and its savior. He originally came to the Jew first, because it was the Jews who sinned against God and who God sent to be the Messiah to save them.

    So, now you can claim I'm a sinner, or non-Christian anything you want, I will say this, I am a born again believer in Yeshua and God my Father. You can say what you will, but all the things I read on this thread is a bunch of rubbish born of the Catholic church.

  • KERYGMA -- THIS IS THE MESSAGE YOU MUST HEAR ( Acts 4:4, 10:44, Rom 10:17)BEFORE YOU DIE AND BELIEVE(Act 16:31,Rom 10:9,1Cor 15:2, Mark 16:16) WHILE YOUR ALIVE TO BE SAVED (Acts 16:31, Rom10:9,1Cor 15:2,Mark16:16) FROM THE COMING WRATH (John 3:36, Rom 2:5, 2:8, Rom5:9,Col 3:6, 1 Thess 1:10) Mark Wilson, one who declares the great good news by the will of God, to those who are perishing; by the will of God to those led away to death; and to those staggering toward slaughter, that is, to those exposed to eternal death and deprived of eternal life; to those lost to the owner "God" and found by the owner's enemy "the devil, or Satan"; to those upon whom God's wrath remains ( John 3:36), to those who are perishing in Portland OR, Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. The LORD, the LORD the compassionate and gracious God want's you to hear the Gospel message...

    (This one won for the "turn or burn" message, plus the self-declaration of being a prophet.)

  • Chocolategaltwo -- So you pray to this Saint who prays to Mary who prays to Jesus who prays to God (Whew) to help you not get a flat tire or find your lost keys?
  • Hit_and_miss -- shame that these things happen...But remember those countries are far behind us in bad religious acts... Anyone remember the crusades?? While we might look at these countries now and be repulsed by how they are acting, that is how our countries acted in the past...and they don't hold a candle to the Spanish inquisition..
  • VFArris01 -- By standing on your soap box "proclaiming" you have sins you show yourself for what you are... a hypocrite (recall Matthew 6)...
  • becauseHelives -- This is not a pleasant story. Billy Graham has been built up to be the most respected popular person in America, Who wants to find out they have been deceived? We will try to give you the facts, or evidence, and may God grant you wisdom as you read this. This section is not propaganda for our own personal views. Years ago, when Fritz set out on his search, he had no final outcome in mind. Fritz isn't concerned with concealing facts one way or the other. There is no desire to stampede our readers any where. We do want to clarify many issues. We do want to help the truth seeker. But the co-authors personally have no battle to win, except that truth be brought forth.

    The issues at stake are not trivial. Historically, Billy Graham's deception is one of the ,,greatest" deceptions that has ever been perpetrated. Some might argue the greatest, making Benedict Arnold, Quisling, and the Trojan Horse pale into insignificance. Allow us to introduce you just briefly into the world of the Illuminati, All top hierarchy Satanists are required to have covers, The Illuminatus will have multiple personalities, and he or she will have one personality that is particularly shown to the outside world. They (the Programmers, handlers and the Illuminati councils) try to get the best covers that they can. They like to be clergymen, but they are also mayors of big cities, lawyers, doctors, etc. A Christian psychiatrist who has worked with numerous victims of Satanism and Multiple Personality Disorder wrote this observation after having worked with a large number of ex-multi-generational programmed Satanic multiples, "Some Satanists have invaded the church as it is the perfect cover for them. They masquerade as angels of light and gravitate towards positions of leadership in order to have more influence. Because much of what they say is sound doctrinally, they are rarely detected. Most survivors whom I have worked with had satanist parents who were in high positions in churches; many were pastors." (Dr. Fox, Loreda. The Spiritual and Clinical Dimensions of Multiple Personality Disorder. Salida, CO: Books of Sangre de Cristo, p. 196.)

    Let us repeat what Dr. Loreda Fox said, "Most survivors whom I have worked with had satanist parents who were in high positions in churches; many were pastors." She didn't say "some," she said MOST. Independently, we have discovered the very same thing. People don't grasp that just because a preacher can sincerely preach what seems a "perfect sermon," doesn't mean that he can't also be part of the Satanic hierarchy. What is happening with the Illuminati's ability to create programmed multiples is that we are getting perfect preachers who are secret hierarchy members. Some of their "perfect sermons" are full of slides, such as "the Christian people need to get involved in the voting process. Christians love to hear such things, it tickles their ears, but the truth is that the entire voting process has been captured and corrupted. Voting machines have repeatedly been exposed to have been rigged, and the controlled media and public denial have prevented Americans from giving up their myth that the common man's votes run this nation. VoteScam - So Easy As To Be Laughable

    (The subject of election corruption is dealt with in Fritz's newsletters, etc.) In Fritz's Be Wise As Serpents book (which exposed Billy Graham as a Luciferian in 1991), it is explained that high level Satanism is Gnosticism which requires that "the Force" of these great satanic magicians be balanced. In other words, in high level Satanism your good deeds must balance your evil deeds. People do not realize that unless someone does "good" deeds they cannot be a high level Satanist.

  • NonTrinitarian -- Besides, if the lowest of the lowest of angels was spoken of in Ps 110, and this angel was going to be given the throne of David, and God transferred the life of this lowly angel to Mary, that same prophecy could be said of that angel. He was David's son because he came from his lineage and he was David's lord because God put him their. Kind of like in verse 1 where the LORD is telling the Lord what to do and that the LORD will tell this Lord when he can go out and rule. (see the first three verses) It's pretty clear which "lord" has more authority. Nope, nothing in there about a two headed Jesus.
  • Tladatsi -- Homosexuality, sex between men, is an abomination. Just read Lev 18:22 "Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it [is] abomination.". Lest there be any misunderstanding this ban on sex between men is repeated in Lev 20:13 is says "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood [shall be] upon them." The Bible says twice that two men have sex as a man and a woman do is an abomination.

    It is also an abomination if a divorced couple to have sex (Deu 24:4). Further, it is an abomination for a woman to wear pants (Deu 22:5). It also says that that eating any sea other than fish is an abomination. Eating lobster, crabs, crawdads, clams, mussels, scallops, shrimp, and prawns is also an abomination (Lev 11:10). It actually says that four (Lev 11:10, 11:11, and 11:12) times, twice as much as homosexual sex.

    However what it does not says is that two cannot love each other or be married.

    One of the on-going arguments about the "Problem of Evil" is that God wanted mankind to have free-will. Evil is an inevitiable by-product (collateral damage if you like) of free will.

    The main problem with this argument is that God did not want mankind (or at least Adam and Eve) to have free-will. In Genesis 2 and 3 we are told that God had planted two trees in the garden of Eden. The fruit of these trees gave whoever ate them certain powers. One was the power of knowing good from evil. The other was immortality.

    We are also told that Adam and Eve did not know good from evil. I think it is safe to say that one cannot exercise free will without knowledge about the implications. How can one choose good over evil if you cannot tell them apart. This is how God created Adam and Eve, without that ability. Further, God forbids Adam and Eve from obtaining that knowledge and ability by eating the special fruit of knowledge of good and evil.

    So God did not want mankind to have free will, it was the talking snake that did. Why did the snake want mankind to have free will, the Bible does not say. Nor does it explain why God placed the magical tree that could give mankind free will in Eden. There it is nonetheless.

  • http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0335345...thread/36266388 -- We think of Islamic martyrs as insane and brainwashed for killing themselves for some religious belief. But, wasn't, dare I point out... Jesus Christ a martyr who died for his religious belief? Isn't the main point of The Passion of the Christ about how great Jesus was for being persecuted by the Roman Empire (much like America in today's world) for his beliefs and dying for them? Wow, this is kind of weird to think about. But Jesus WAS a martyr. What's the difference between him and the nuts to kill themselves (or allow themselves to be killed) for their religious beliefs? At least William Wallace allowed himself to die for something real. Jesus just died for some theological belief, just like any other martyr. He's not "the greatest person that ever lived". He's just a martyr! No greater than any other brainwashed nut in today's world who feels persecuted by the dominant empire and dies for his religious beliefs.

    PS I don't mean to offend anyone, I'm just pointing out something.

  • SteveF (on "Brokeback Mountain") -- BV defined love by commitment (and presumably some other things); I argued that the two protagonists do show commitment to each other (what they demonstrate towards their wives is irrelevant) and therefore by his criteria they are in love.
  • http://www.bju.edu/prospective/expect/rhall.html -- New Age, jazz, rock, and country music is not permitted. Contemporary Christian music is not permitted (e.g., Michael W. Smith, Stephen Curtis Chapman, WOW Worship, and so forth). All weapons must be turned in for storage. Trigger locks are required for pistols. Fireworks are not permitted on campus.
  • Bagger_Vance -- It is funny how suicide is stigmatized in some situations but not in others. When Jesus killed himself we were all supposedly saved...and yes he did kill himself because he said that he laid his life down for us. That is a suicide. The christians that allowed themselves to be fed to lions were suicidal. If they can submit to nature and die why can't someone kill themselves in the face of cancer?
  • http://rwor.org/a/series/godorigina...st-children.jpg -- "This engraving of a bible scene depicts the killing of children. The Bible is filled with dozens of similar scenes of slaughter, cruelty, and rape, approvingly written about provided that they are carried out on "orders from God."" (What's comical about it is that the scene they depict is obviously the slaughter of the innocents. This may actually be the first time in history that it has been suggested that Herod's slaughter was 'on orders from God.')
  • undead -- Asking a bunch of theologians about women's headcoverings will almost certainly get you a dissertation on why they should not be applied (culturally specific). However, most discerning people will soon cotton onto the fact that culture does not feature as reason for action or non-action anywhere in the NT.

    It is obvious that 1 Cor 11;2-> is nothing to do with culture, or if it is, it is speciific to the culture of the true church (as opposed to the gnostic church that abandoned obedience to the apostles).

  • OMEGA7 -- If you look at the Angelic beings mentioned in the Bible ,you see common traits . 1.They Radiate Energy which is possibly radioactive. 2. They give off alot of Light. 3. Their Legs and feet have the appearance of Beryl or Burnished Brass. 4. Their bodies seem to be vibrating at a higher resinance than humans. How did God make them ? Are they made of Plasma , Radioactive Material or Spirit.

    According to John1:1 , there are only 2 Gods. The Holy Spirit is just a spirit combination that is a combination of the Spirit essence of Jesus mixed with the Life giving spirit of the Father. When Jesus went up to the Father , the Father Re-Glorified Jesus and then absorbed the mental chararcter and resistance to sin that Jesus learned and mixed it with His own and sent it down to the Apostles as the Holy Spirit. GOD is an Energy Being . What kind of Energy Composition is the Question. We know that HE emits alot of Light. We know that HE has hands feet eyes face feet etc. We know that HE made Angels out of something that gives off light too. Mt 28:3 His countenance was like lightning, and his raiment white as snow:

    Maybe, God is PHOTONIC ? Seriously, God is LIGHT , which is a form of Energy and behaves like a Wave and also, a Particle. HE is most likely a Gas and Energy combination like a Star which is Hydrogen & Helium in Fusion. No wonder Jesus had a hard time explaining it to the people. Where does it say that God created light when HE IS LIGHT ?????

  • Seasanctuary -- God is a morally odd fellow. No crime is too heinous for him to stop here on Earth; yet after this Earth every slight misdemeanor earns us an eternity in God's dungeon of torments. He errs on both sides.

    Today he bears the guilt of moral apathy. For he is able to safely save us from car accidents, tidal waves, murder sprees, and rapists...but he's not willing. The next time you hear about one of these atrocities, keep in mind that God was right there...not helping.

    Tommorrow he promises to outdo every human who has ever caused another pain. All human crimes pale next to the eternal evil God will continually maintain to torment us. Bind - Torture - Never Kill. In restrospect, God's apathy should come as no surprise if his conscience is this seared and malicious.

    Now I'm not perfect. No human is...or has to be to look like a shining example of virtue and care next to such a monster. We either fail to achieve such a level of moral detachment or fail to commit such infinite violations against our neighbor. We're better because we lack the capacity to be so bad.

    There's only so many "evil for humans; good for God" explanations before this all becomes apparent. I wouldn't trust the tactics of appeasement to last forever against such a one. There is no safety against an evil God.

  • etb_wm_sharon -- Yes, you should remember me. You grilled me on the thread about Pornography and its negative effects on women. Ever notice a woman's input is always irrelevant, unless it agrees with exactly what men want to hear?

    January 30, 2006, Edward T. Babinski wrote: I think the majority of human male primates on this planet are muscle bound testosterone driven brutes who commonly seek either psychological or physical domination over other males, females, and children. Males continue to fill our prisons more than women do. Just google up all the major horror stories reported by the news any day of the year and males continue to make bold verbal threats and murder and wage wars. Males continue to murder males galore even in their own coutries in gang warfare, organized crime, family disputes, robberies, and of course rape, torture and murder of females and children as well.

    And holy books continue to contain verses about females being there to "serve and obey" males, which is also the message of the apes of the secular world as well. Even Hinduism preaches that being reincarnated as a female is not equal to being reincarnated as a male. Actually, I suspect the reverse is nearer the truth and that being reincarnated as a female is something more Hindu males ought to aspire to. I also suspect that more Muslim and Christian male ought to listen to females and make plans together with them rather than continue to inculcate in the female mind the necessity of "serving and obeying" them.

    Still, even in an ideal world without males being physically and psychologically more dominating due to the effects of testosterone, I imagine that communication would remain difficult, as it often is even between two females, or two males. So there is no obvious solution to all the world's difficulties in reaching agreements. Also, some males are quite good at science and technology and at devoting themselves toward fixing some of the world's problems. Other law abiding males are relatively benign in the effects they have on society. Still others make mistakes and ask to be forgiven. So, the domineering and violent tendencies of male human beings in general must not be confused with every male--that would be a case of irrational prejudice.

    In the end the only real resource we have for the future of humanity is the education of both males and females, both being allowed to pursue the quest for knowledge and a higher education and creativity as far as they each can go.

  • Sheli -- Home group fellowships are where it is at. Nowhere else.

    Organized religion did not occur until Emperor Constantine appropriated Christianity. He mixed it with organized Paganism, its churches, priests, buildings, wealth, ceremonies, astrological celebrations, mythology, and popular acceptance. The result was Catholicism, and later its child, Protestantism.